This Forum is Dedicated For all The Object Oriented PIC Lovers .......... The concept behind OOPic is straight forward. Use preprogrammed multitasking Objects from a library of highly optimized Objects to do all the work of interacting with the hardware. Then write small scripts in Basic, C, or Java syntax styles to control the Objects. During operation, the Objects run continuously and simultaneously in the background while the scripts run in the foreground telling the objects what to do.

Friday, August 1, 2008

[oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

Read my last post Ray, all will be spared forever just not updated.

Ted

--- In oopic@yahoogroups.com, "ray xu" <rayxu@...> wrote:
>
> Ok now that you have cleared up things before I left, that settles
things
> for me; I may still go with the oopic, but still unsure. The least
> you/Savage can do is spare the compiler and the tech stuff.
>
>
>
> Also, there's one more thing your missing about the compiler
problems; its
> that when you have another language besides English installed on
the PC, the
> compiler gets very confused and doesn't operate properly.
>
>
>
> ___________________
> Ray Xu
> rayxu@...
> DPRG <http://www.dprg.org> member
> OOPic <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/oopic/> group member
> Seattle <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/SeattleRobotics/>
Robotics
> group member
> My Blog <http://rayxublogs.blogspot.com/>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: oopic@yahoogroups.com [mailto:oopic@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of
> theo570
> Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 7:38 PM
> To: oopic@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and
etc.. UPDATE
>
>
>
> Ok so that didn't go over too well... Please take the time and READ!
>
> I am sorry guys, don't blame the messenger. I am not the major
share
> holder in the program here, rather, the little guy that gets the
> dirty work.
>
> The decision was decreed to me and I passed it along.
>
> SO now we wont gloss over any facts... 2 YES 2 whole ooPics sold in
> July. Yup we can sure make a business out of that. Thats what? 170
> bucks worth of sales, care to run a business on that? When it was
300
> units a month no problem or even 100 but 2? Don't forget that the
> whopping 170 is before we pay to have the boards made and pay for a
> website and pay for packaging etc... We also can't buy the boards
one
> at a time, they come in hundreds.
>
> I truely am sorry that two different days had two different
versions,
> I did pass on the decisions play by play, right or wrong.
>
> It does suck, for me as much as you. Not only is every robot I own
> ooPic powered, some going back two A1 boards, I teach robotics as
> well and guess what... every student I have is using one version or
> another of the ooPic. I slipped once and used an avr, but I jumped
> back.
>
> I can't un make you pissed off and I can't make it all better. Of
> course we do not want you to leave, that would be silly. I know
that
> SI has traditionally been weak on after the sale support and we are
> trying to fix that. Anyone feel free to chime in and offer to do
tech
> support for free? Dennis did not want to...
>
> I will talk to Scott further about the compiler and see if he can't
> patch up the oEvent code before it is fully retired. The only two
> real complaints that I could find by reading back, and recent
posts,
> come down to bad oEvents and Vista issues correct?
>
> Dennis was not let go like some are trying to imply. Before my time
> there was another much larger partner who decided to quit paying
him
> then that partner decided to move along, thats when I came along.
> Things were bad and we had one new product that was starting to
sell.
>
> Please try and understand the business side of the decision, no
money
> coming in means it is very hard to dedicate unpaid time to that
> product. As much as we would like to keep on going with the old we
> personnaly cannot, we all have bills to pay and the new might pay
> them. Every decision made was strictly financial.
>
> I will move the compiler files to somewhere else. That site being
> down was unitentional, poorly timed and certianly not done on
> purpose. I will let you know where they end up. I am not even sure
> why it went down just yet.
>
> If you do decide to move along we are sorry to see you go and THANK
> YOU for all the years of support. If you read the above, you now
> understand why the decisions were made and we hope that with a
little
> patience you will stick it out for the ooPic Pro series.
>
> If you did decide to hang in there then THANK YOU to that crowd.
>
> If you have already swam the river all we can do is try to make a
> better product with better support and try to get you to swim back.
>
> Really, if you feel qualified and want to hang the moniker of SI
Tech
> Support on your signature send me an email. It is an unpaid
position
> for now but that will change in the future we hope. bigbug@oobug.
> <mailto:bigbug%40oobug.com> com.
>
> Jessica, It seems you may have inadvertantly left some of the facts
> out of your post and because we have worked together for so long I
> will not correct your mistakes in here. You may however contact me
> for a complete and correct list. Your financial woes in business
and
> with SI/Pentar were before my time.
>
> Ted
> Savage Innovations
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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Re: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

I am not one bit surprised that you only sold two in July. The people on
this board have been telling you since December of last year. (look at the
events again thread) that events didn't work. If I look at this board for
information and find out that not only doesn't he product work but you are not fixing
it I am sure as heck not going to buy one. That's business 101.

**************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget?
Read reviews on AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 )


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

--- In oopic@yahoogroups.com, "ray xu" <rayxu@...> wrote:
>
> One more thing, (sorry for this extra) company's main priority is to
satisfy
> the customers, but by doing something like dropping all support on a
bunch
> of popular products (theo) makes customers angry, and wont buy from
it.
> Thanks a lot my major school project is going to be late if it does go
> unsupported anytime in the near future.
>

I think we have differing definitions of support or the lack there of.

Our intent is to focus on NEW product and try to pay the bills. We
cannot develop futher on old product so it stands as is. Please don't
get to thinking your ooPic is going to quit working, my green aliens
are still truckin' right along.

No, there will not be any newly manufactured old product such as the
C,S and R. That is unless we get a surge in interest all of the sudden.

No, we cannot do more work on the compiler RIGHT NOW. Maybe after the
dust settles and we get some new stuff on the market we can fall back
and make a few legacy tweaks. But it is what it is for now.

I am not sure how this affects your school project. Your ooPic does
what you bought it to to correct? The compiler is still and will always
be available. This group is still here and full of users who love to
help people out. If you have a real tricky question I can pull Scotts
head out of the code bag long enough to get him to answer a question. I
am around and if I have the same hardware on my bench I can wire up and
test your code out adn see if I can find a fix as well.

Unsupported does not mean gone it just means no more dev work.

Read my last post and try to understand our position please.

Here is something UNTESTED for VISTA users. Try turning the UAC OFF. It
seems to make the BioLab work just fine on Vista and it has the same
basic framework as the old compiler.

Ted
Savage Innovations


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RE: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

And plus, maybe it would be a good idea to make the oobug into the oopic C,
S, or R form (Just replace the chipset). It would be a lot more flexible,
especially to me, and it would keep the R, S, and C still on-the-shelf.

___________________
Ray Xu
rayxu@tx.rr.com
DPRG <http://www.dprg.org> member
OOPic <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/oopic/> group member
Seattle <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/SeattleRobotics/> Robotics
group member
My Blog <http://rayxublogs.blogspot.com/>

-----Original Message-----
From: oopic@yahoogroups.com [mailto:oopic@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ray
xu
Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 7:44 PM
To: oopic@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc..
UPDATE

Ok now that you have cleared up things before I left, that settles things
for me; I may still go with the oopic, but still unsure. The least
you/Savage can do is spare the compiler and the tech stuff.

Also, there's one more thing your missing about the compiler problems; its
that when you have another language besides English installed on the PC, the
compiler gets very confused and doesn't operate properly.

___________________
Ray Xu
rayxu@tx.rr. <mailto:rayxu%40tx.rr.com> com
DPRG <http://www.dprg. <http://www.dprg.org> org> member
OOPic <http://tech. <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/oopic/>
groups.yahoo.com/group/oopic/> group member
Seattle <http://tech. <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/SeattleRobotics/>
groups.yahoo.com/group/SeattleRobotics/> Robotics
group member
My Blog <http://rayxublogs. <http://rayxublogs.blogspot.com/> blogspot.com/>


-----Original Message-----
From: oopic@yahoogroups. <mailto:oopic%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:oopic@yahoogroups. <mailto:oopic%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
theo570
Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 7:38 PM
To: oopic@yahoogroups. <mailto:oopic%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

Ok so that didn't go over too well... Please take the time and READ!

I am sorry guys, don't blame the messenger. I am not the major share
holder in the program here, rather, the little guy that gets the
dirty work.

The decision was decreed to me and I passed it along.

SO now we wont gloss over any facts... 2 YES 2 whole ooPics sold in
July. Yup we can sure make a business out of that. Thats what? 170
bucks worth of sales, care to run a business on that? When it was 300
units a month no problem or even 100 but 2? Don't forget that the
whopping 170 is before we pay to have the boards made and pay for a
website and pay for packaging etc... We also can't buy the boards one
at a time, they come in hundreds.

I truely am sorry that two different days had two different versions,
I did pass on the decisions play by play, right or wrong.

It does suck, for me as much as you. Not only is every robot I own
ooPic powered, some going back two A1 boards, I teach robotics as
well and guess what... every student I have is using one version or
another of the ooPic. I slipped once and used an avr, but I jumped
back.

I can't un make you pissed off and I can't make it all better. Of
course we do not want you to leave, that would be silly. I know that
SI has traditionally been weak on after the sale support and we are
trying to fix that. Anyone feel free to chime in and offer to do tech
support for free? Dennis did not want to...

I will talk to Scott further about the compiler and see if he can't
patch up the oEvent code before it is fully retired. The only two
real complaints that I could find by reading back, and recent posts,
come down to bad oEvents and Vista issues correct?

Dennis was not let go like some are trying to imply. Before my time
there was another much larger partner who decided to quit paying him
then that partner decided to move along, thats when I came along.
Things were bad and we had one new product that was starting to sell.

Please try and understand the business side of the decision, no money
coming in means it is very hard to dedicate unpaid time to that
product. As much as we would like to keep on going with the old we
personnaly cannot, we all have bills to pay and the new might pay
them. Every decision made was strictly financial.

I will move the compiler files to somewhere else. That site being
down was unitentional, poorly timed and certianly not done on
purpose. I will let you know where they end up. I am not even sure
why it went down just yet.

If you do decide to move along we are sorry to see you go and THANK
YOU for all the years of support. If you read the above, you now
understand why the decisions were made and we hope that with a little
patience you will stick it out for the ooPic Pro series.

If you did decide to hang in there then THANK YOU to that crowd.

If you have already swam the river all we can do is try to make a
better product with better support and try to get you to swim back.

Really, if you feel qualified and want to hang the moniker of SI Tech
Support on your signature send me an email. It is an unpaid position
for now but that will change in the future we hope. bigbug@oobug.
<mailto:bigbug%40oobug.com> com.

Jessica, It seems you may have inadvertantly left some of the facts
out of your post and because we have worked together for so long I
will not correct your mistakes in here. You may however contact me
for a complete and correct list. Your financial woes in business and
with SI/Pentar were before my time.

Ted
Savage Innovations

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


------------------------------------

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<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

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RE: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

Ok now that you have cleared up things before I left, that settles things
for me; I may still go with the oopic, but still unsure. The least
you/Savage can do is spare the compiler and the tech stuff.

Also, there's one more thing your missing about the compiler problems; its
that when you have another language besides English installed on the PC, the
compiler gets very confused and doesn't operate properly.

___________________
Ray Xu
rayxu@tx.rr.com
DPRG <http://www.dprg.org> member
OOPic <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/oopic/> group member
Seattle <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/SeattleRobotics/> Robotics
group member
My Blog <http://rayxublogs.blogspot.com/>

-----Original Message-----
From: oopic@yahoogroups.com [mailto:oopic@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
theo570
Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 7:38 PM
To: oopic@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

Ok so that didn't go over too well... Please take the time and READ!

I am sorry guys, don't blame the messenger. I am not the major share
holder in the program here, rather, the little guy that gets the
dirty work.

The decision was decreed to me and I passed it along.

SO now we wont gloss over any facts... 2 YES 2 whole ooPics sold in
July. Yup we can sure make a business out of that. Thats what? 170
bucks worth of sales, care to run a business on that? When it was 300
units a month no problem or even 100 but 2? Don't forget that the
whopping 170 is before we pay to have the boards made and pay for a
website and pay for packaging etc... We also can't buy the boards one
at a time, they come in hundreds.

I truely am sorry that two different days had two different versions,
I did pass on the decisions play by play, right or wrong.

It does suck, for me as much as you. Not only is every robot I own
ooPic powered, some going back two A1 boards, I teach robotics as
well and guess what... every student I have is using one version or
another of the ooPic. I slipped once and used an avr, but I jumped
back.

I can't un make you pissed off and I can't make it all better. Of
course we do not want you to leave, that would be silly. I know that
SI has traditionally been weak on after the sale support and we are
trying to fix that. Anyone feel free to chime in and offer to do tech
support for free? Dennis did not want to...

I will talk to Scott further about the compiler and see if he can't
patch up the oEvent code before it is fully retired. The only two
real complaints that I could find by reading back, and recent posts,
come down to bad oEvents and Vista issues correct?

Dennis was not let go like some are trying to imply. Before my time
there was another much larger partner who decided to quit paying him
then that partner decided to move along, thats when I came along.
Things were bad and we had one new product that was starting to sell.

Please try and understand the business side of the decision, no money
coming in means it is very hard to dedicate unpaid time to that
product. As much as we would like to keep on going with the old we
personnaly cannot, we all have bills to pay and the new might pay
them. Every decision made was strictly financial.

I will move the compiler files to somewhere else. That site being
down was unitentional, poorly timed and certianly not done on
purpose. I will let you know where they end up. I am not even sure
why it went down just yet.

If you do decide to move along we are sorry to see you go and THANK
YOU for all the years of support. If you read the above, you now
understand why the decisions were made and we hope that with a little
patience you will stick it out for the ooPic Pro series.

If you did decide to hang in there then THANK YOU to that crowd.

If you have already swam the river all we can do is try to make a
better product with better support and try to get you to swim back.

Really, if you feel qualified and want to hang the moniker of SI Tech
Support on your signature send me an email. It is an unpaid position
for now but that will change in the future we hope. bigbug@oobug.
<mailto:bigbug%40oobug.com> com.

Jessica, It seems you may have inadvertantly left some of the facts
out of your post and because we have worked together for so long I
will not correct your mistakes in here. You may however contact me
for a complete and correct list. Your financial woes in business and
with SI/Pentar were before my time.

Ted
Savage Innovations

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


------------------------------------

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Re: [oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

On Aug 1, 2008, at 5:07 PM, ray xu wrote:

> One more thing, (sorry for this extra) company's main priority is to
> satisfy
> the customers, but by doing something like dropping all support on a
> bunch
> of popular products (theo) makes customers angry, and wont buy from
> it.
> Thanks a lot my major school project is going to be late if it does go
> unsupported anytime in the near future.

For good support, go to Parallax. Their support is superb. I don't
really like the Basic Stamp 2 but their Propeller chip is fantastic,
once you get past the fact that there is no built-in A:D or D:A. There
is enough in their object library to do almost anything you want to do.

I have asked Parallax to do a version of their BoeBot with a Propeller
and then put a decent A:D chip on the board with support libraries.
With something like that I can get back to teaching robotics to the
kids at school.

BTW, until today's announcement I was planning to expand my use of the
OOPic at our school. Several of my students have purchased MarkIIIs
and other OOPic-powered 'bots. I was even considering replacing all
our BoeBots with ooBugs. It would be perfect for my classes.

But how can I trust Savage to support me? They have just dropped my
current environment on its face.

To Savage Innovations: you know, it would have been so simple. All you
had to do was do one last fix of core functionality (events comes to
mind here) THEN announce that you are going to end-of-life all the old
products but you will release the occasional bug fix. You would have
kept everyone on board I bet.

--

Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori
brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd.
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA
http://www.gbmontessori.com

I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
— Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C
PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C


------------------------------------

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[oopic] Re: Savage Innovations / Compiler / ooBug and etc.. UPDATE

Ok so that didn't go over too well... Please take the time and READ!

I am sorry guys, don't blame the messenger. I am not the major share
holder in the program here, rather, the little guy that gets the
dirty work.

The decision was decreed to me and I passed it along.

SO now we wont gloss over any facts... 2 YES 2 whole ooPics sold in
July. Yup we can sure make a business out of that. Thats what? 170
bucks worth of sales, care to run a business on that? When it was 300
units a month no problem or even 100 but 2? Don't forget that the
whopping 170 is before we pay to have the boards made and pay for a
website and pay for packaging etc... We also can't buy the boards one
at a time, they come in hundreds.

I truely am sorry that two different days had two different versions,
I did pass on the decisions play by play, right or wrong.

It does suck, for me as much as you. Not only is every robot I own
ooPic powered, some going back two A1 boards, I teach robotics as
well and guess what... every student I have is using one version or
another of the ooPic. I slipped once and used an avr, but I jumped
back.

I can't un make you pissed off and I can't make it all better. Of
course we do not want you to leave, that would be silly. I know that
SI has traditionally been weak on after the sale support and we are
trying to fix that. Anyone feel free to chime in and offer to do tech
support for free? Dennis did not want to...

I will talk to Scott further about the compiler and see if he can't
patch up the oEvent code before it is fully retired. The only two
real complaints that I could find by reading back, and recent posts,
come down to bad oEvents and Vista issues correct?

Dennis was not let go like some are trying to imply. Before my time
there was another much larger partner who decided to quit paying him
then that partner decided to move along, thats when I came along.
Things were bad and we had one new product that was starting to sell.

Please try and understand the business side of the decision, no money
coming in means it is very hard to dedicate unpaid time to that
product. As much as we would like to keep on going with the old we
personnaly cannot, we all have bills to pay and the new might pay
them. Every decision made was strictly financial.

I will move the compiler files to somewhere else. That site being
down was unitentional, poorly timed and certianly not done on
purpose. I will let you know where they end up. I am not even sure
why it went down just yet.

If you do decide to move along we are sorry to see you go and THANK
YOU for all the years of support. If you read the above, you now
understand why the decisions were made and we hope that with a little
patience you will stick it out for the ooPic Pro series.

If you did decide to hang in there then THANK YOU to that crowd.

If you have already swam the river all we can do is try to make a
better product with better support and try to get you to swim back.

Really, if you feel qualified and want to hang the moniker of SI Tech
Support on your signature send me an email. It is an unpaid position
for now but that will change in the future we hope. bigbug@oobug.com.

Jessica, It seems you may have inadvertantly left some of the facts
out of your post and because we have worked together for so long I
will not correct your mistakes in here. You may however contact me
for a complete and correct list. Your financial woes in business and
with SI/Pentar were before my time.

Ted
Savage Innovations

------------------------------------

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<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/oopic/

<*> Your email settings:
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